Boat Building Forum

Find advice on all aspects of building your own kayak, canoe or any lightweight boats

Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
By:Aaron H
Date: 6/9/2009, 3:36 pm
In Response To: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF *Pic* (Michael Collins)

Do you know what make and model glass kayak your friend was paddling? Some insight into what was 'running circles around you' will help in understanding weather or not it was due to the boat or the paddler.

Unfortunately, boat length alone (or more appropriately, waterline length) does not make you a faster paddler. Unless we are talking about a very narrow and challenging kayak, it may well be that your friend simply has more strength, stamina, and paddling technique. That's not to diminish you, but you should understand that longer generally doesn't equate to faster unless you have the strength and stamina to overcome the greater wetted surface area and associated drag that comes with the longer waterline. You can achieve a lower wetted surface area by making a very narrow kayak, but without sufficient balance and paddling ability, you may well find yourself spending all of your energy just trying to stay upright.

Increasing waterline length does raise the "hull speed" but it does not necessarily lower resistance at lower speeds. If wetted surface area were identical between your friend's boat and your F1, then yes, the longer kayak would certainly be easier to propel at a faster speed for a given effort, but I suspect that your F1 has lower resistance at typical paddling speeds for us mere mortals. Brian would no doubt tell you that was the entire premise behind building a "short" sea kayak.

I went down a similar road as well, in search of speed. I built a 16' x 21" kayak, with similar waterline length to many 17'+ kayaks, and I was surprised, not because I was suddenly that much faster, but by the fact that I did not have sufficient strength to obtain the speeds I thought it should provide.

Your best bet (although it is certainly not as fun as building another kayak) is to train and develop strength, stamina, and technique to paddle any kayak quickly.

: I went out with a friend
: who had a 3,000 dollar, 17' fiberglass boat and it could have paddled
: circles around me and the F1. I'm looking to build another skin on frame
: which will be able to keep up with my friends. My main goal here is
: speed/efficiency.

Messages In This Thread

Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF *Pic*
Michael Collins -- 6/8/2009, 11:10 pm
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
Aaron H -- 6/9/2009, 3:36 pm
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
Michael Collins -- 6/9/2009, 10:39 pm
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
Aaron H -- 6/10/2009, 6:11 pm
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
Brian Scaborough -- 6/10/2009, 10:21 am
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
John D. -- 6/10/2009, 3:02 pm
The Long Boat Myth *LINK* *Pic*
Kudzu -- 6/9/2009, 7:43 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Mike Savage -- 6/11/2009, 7:01 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Johne -- 6/11/2009, 12:08 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Michael -- 6/11/2009, 10:23 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth *Pic*
Allan -- 6/11/2009, 3:54 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Bill Hamm -- 6/11/2009, 9:50 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Kudzu -- 6/11/2009, 11:56 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Michael Collins -- 6/11/2009, 1:58 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Kudzu -- 6/11/2009, 5:33 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Bill Hamm -- 6/13/2009, 1:23 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Terry Haines -- 6/18/2009, 11:45 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Bill Hamm -- 6/19/2009, 11:39 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
John F Monroe -- 6/24/2009, 5:42 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Terry Haines -- 6/19/2009, 6:33 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Bill Hamm -- 6/11/2009, 1:26 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Kudzu -- 6/11/2009, 7:42 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Allan -- 6/11/2009, 8:02 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Kudzu -- 6/11/2009, 9:19 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
West -- 6/11/2009, 4:23 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Allan -- 6/11/2009, 7:45 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Ken Brunton -- 6/10/2009, 11:13 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Kudzu -- 6/10/2009, 1:40 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Michael Collins -- 6/10/2009, 2:16 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Kudzu -- 6/10/2009, 7:52 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Bill Hamm -- 6/10/2009, 3:44 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Michael Collins -- 6/9/2009, 10:26 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Kudzu -- 6/10/2009, 8:33 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Nick Schade - Guillemot Kayaks -- 6/10/2009, 8:49 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Kudzu -- 6/10/2009, 1:08 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Nick Schade - Guillemot Kayaks -- 6/11/2009, 10:35 am
Hey Nick
Kudzu -- 6/12/2009, 10:18 am
Single change??
Allan -- 6/12/2009, 6:47 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Kudzu -- 6/11/2009, 12:04 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Glen Smith -- 6/9/2009, 8:16 pm
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Kudzu -- 6/10/2009, 8:17 am
Re: The Long Boat Myth
Nick Schade - Guillemot Kayaks -- 6/10/2009, 8:57 am
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
Bill Hamm -- 6/9/2009, 1:15 am
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
Brian Scaborough -- 6/9/2009, 8:32 am
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
wwfloyd -- 6/10/2009, 7:47 pm
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
Bill Hamm -- 6/11/2009, 1:00 am
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF *LINK* *Pic*
Tom Yost -- 6/9/2009, 10:24 am
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
Bill Hamm -- 6/9/2009, 8:28 pm
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
Tom Yost -- 6/10/2009, 12:41 am
LMAO!
Robert N Pruden -- 6/9/2009, 2:43 pm
Re: LMAO! *Pic*
Tom Yost -- 6/9/2009, 6:13 pm
Re: LMAO!
Bill Hamm -- 6/9/2009, 8:30 pm
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
Brian Scaborough -- 6/9/2009, 10:40 am
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
Michael Collins -- 6/9/2009, 11:11 pm
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
Brian Scaborough -- 6/10/2009, 1:00 pm
Balancing Gear
Michael Collins -- 6/10/2009, 2:01 pm
Re: Balancing Gear
Bill Hamm -- 6/10/2009, 3:40 pm
Re: Balancing Gear *LINK*
Brian Scaborough -- 6/10/2009, 2:27 pm
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF *Pic*
Tom Yost -- 6/9/2009, 11:01 am
I've done that, too, but only with the Guinness.
Robert N Pruden -- 6/9/2009, 2:46 pm
Re: Skin-on-Frame: Fast, Playful SOF
Brian Scarborough -- 6/9/2009, 12:00 am
Rider, Ranger?
Michael Collins -- 6/9/2009, 11:07 pm
Re: Rider, Ranger?
Bill Hamm -- 6/10/2009, 2:27 am