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Its not geodesic
By:mike allen
Date: 1/12/2001, 9:29 pm
In Response To: Geodesic Kayak? (George Cushing)

: I'm thinking of using Platt Monfort's geodesic building method for a sea
: kayak. Anyone in the world tried this? If not, anybody have a good skin
: and frame design that I can adapt? My goal is to develop a design that
: you've got to throw rocks in to keep it from going airborne.
: Geo. C.

First of all, I don't think monforts stuff is geodesic. Admittedly, it would be hard to do on all his boats except the yak. And a yak is where a geodesic concept would work. A simplistic basic idea behind geodesics is developing a spherical or curved system with minimum elements for example great curves on a sphere being the shortest distance (or most minimal structure)betw any 2 pts. on the curvce. Solidly locking any 3 great circles ofg different orientations brings a stable system.

But monfort uses 4 segments plus diagonal tension members for stability in addition to the tensile dacorn fagric. Sound like duplication and one extra member to me.

But a yak is great as many(NOT the ones with sharp shear or mimimal traditions) have a roundish cross section but unfortunately all have disproportionate length to the width.

So what I would do is take an existing rounded shape yak, like a guillemot (shorter the better) and use that as the form, intending on breaking it around the c/l, pulling out the real yak and regluing. In order to simulate the graet circles and trianglulation w/ minimal members, no kevlar tension just the dacron. The gt circle3 simulationwould be to start at the very stern of the yak forem and wrap 1/16in.(thin thin)x 1/2in ash around and around towards the bow so in plan view it makes like a 30 angle w/ the sheer. So the spacing changes along the length so that near the middle the spacing is abt 10-12 in and goes dn to 3-4in at ends. THen andother wrapper in the sam direcrtion but at halfway inbetween so crosses the 'midline' or shear directly opposit ea other.

Then 2 more wraps going the other way around so that each opposite shear and deck and keel have intersections at abt 6in in the middle goin dn to 1-3 in. at the ends. Both directions together sorta make diagonal great circlea round the yak.

for the middle half ot the yak I might do once more. Might pull some out of ends.

Then on sheers, deckpeak, keel and 2 stringers on the hull I;d pull straight strips under the previous dianonallly wound and glue all together w/ a flexible glue(sikaflex, polyurethane?) and add 4in underside laps to all strips at the midline. And add say 1/8in wide strips on the outside of the stringers. Every single intersection of any strip must be glued.

Cut the yak in half,halfway thru the laps and reglue together (like the laps are not glued on one side and you just cut the diag thru to them and then use thatn to line up and the laps to glue. Maybe hang one end fron a high clg and use a ladder to get to the c/l in order to keep all realigned. Shrink on dacron.

Experience would now show where the triangulation could be reduced. Hopefully it would flex around impacts. Airbags inflated to keep section wherever possible.

Foot pegs rails glued w/ a flex glue ok. - add to structure, but you'd want to minimize so mauybe use horizontal webbing attached to a 3 or 4 jts ea side, maybe a buckle for adjustmt

The idea is to minimize.

-mick

Messages In This Thread

Geodesic Kayak?
George Cushing -- 1/11/2001, 11:02 am
Its not geodesic
mike allen -- 1/12/2001, 9:29 pm
how do ya join dacron
tom preska -- 1/14/2001, 11:26 am
Re: how do ya join dacron
Bill Price -- 1/14/2001, 12:39 pm
thanks bill *NM*
tom preska -- 1/14/2001, 1:32 pm
Re: Says You!
Bucky Fuller -- 1/13/2001, 8:55 pm
I beseech thee, my apology
mike allen -- 1/15/2001, 12:43 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Bill Price -- 1/11/2001, 1:10 pm
How will the foot braces attach? *NM*
Mike -- 1/12/2001, 6:11 pm
Re: How will the foot braces attach?
Bill Price -- 1/13/2001, 2:48 pm
Post a sketch?
Jerry Hayes -- 1/12/2001, 6:02 pm
Re: Post a sketch? Never mind ;)
Jerry Hayes -- 1/12/2001, 7:28 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Eric Schade (shearwater boats) -- 1/11/2001, 3:50 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Nick Schade - Guillemot Kayaks -- 1/11/2001, 4:43 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Easy, now
David Dick -- 1/12/2001, 7:22 am
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Easy, now
Al Gunther -- 1/14/2001, 11:53 am
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Easy, now
David Dick -- 1/15/2001, 9:55 am
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Easy, now
Al Gunther -- 1/15/2001, 10:55 am
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Easy, now
David Dick -- 1/16/2001, 8:00 am
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Easy, now
Bill Price -- 1/13/2001, 2:42 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Easy, now
David Dick -- 1/14/2001, 12:42 am
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Bob Newton -- 1/11/2001, 9:45 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Bill Price -- 1/12/2001, 12:20 am
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Bill Price -- 1/11/2001, 5:17 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Nick Schade - Guillemot Kayaks -- 1/12/2001, 9:40 am
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Bill Price -- 1/13/2001, 2:33 pm
spacing intermediate ribs
Paul G. Jacobson -- 1/12/2001, 4:03 am
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Shawn Baker -- 1/11/2001, 6:48 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Bill Price -- 1/11/2001, 7:06 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Rehd -- 1/11/2001, 6:39 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Bill Price -- 1/11/2001, 6:57 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
jtmc -- 1/11/2001, 9:14 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Rehd -- 1/11/2001, 7:33 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Rehd -- 1/11/2001, 2:26 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? Maybe :-)
Bill Price -- 1/11/2001, 3:34 pm
Re: Geodesic Kayak? *Pic*
Mike Hanks -- 1/11/2001, 11:58 am
Re: Great Minds?
George Cushing -- 1/11/2001, 6:45 pm