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Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip *LINK* *Pic*
By:Toni V
Date: 12/6/2007, 4:07 am
In Response To: Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip *Pic* (Kris Buttermore)

Hi, My comments down there:

: The chine stringer on many Greenland types dives in under the skin a ways
: back from the bow to accomplish a smooth transition.

I'm not talking about longitudal appearance of chines, but in height direction.
See these two examples (Illorsuit one is made by Bryan Hansel, hope you don't mind to borrow it in here).

http://personal.inet.fi/koti/tonivee/temp/illorsuit.jpg
http://personal.inet.fi/koti/tonivee/temp/kog20.jpg

Bow is at right. Notice how the Iggy's chine comes high above waterline. Thus the waterline has sharp angle there. If you see the other example, you'll see how the waterline is smooth and chines protrude below waterline. I believe this is the usual Greenlandic way. Some kayaks like Illorsuit and ones making for tight chop seem to have this kind of chine arrangement. Maybe the usual waterline doesn't come directly, but from steep wave and thus this chine would be better. I'm not sure much much it will increase resistance, but I think there's some.

I believe it's doable in S&G if the panels twist enough - ie. if the plywood is strong enough.

: Henk's are the only ones I've seen with where the bottom panels arc gently up
: and then reverse back downward to a termination at the bow knuckle. I do
: think it gives an interesting look - and just about anything even remotely
: kayak-like can work well enough so I think he could follow this sort of
: design thinking happily for many years. Still, the tow tank/wind tunnel
: simulators in my mind and my carving/shaping/sculpting instincts both have
: fits with it.

I think you are looking it a bit wrong - when the kayak side is practically straight it doesn't matter where the chine panels meet the bottom ones. Forgot the panel corners and look the shape. From a quick look, I don't see major shape difference with Henk's implementation or yours.

(About kog #6)
: Do you mean on the PC or on the water?

Well, proven in computer and similar talk from real world, but no actual measurements.

: The longer and skinnier they get, the less relevant hull speed is as any sort
: of performance indicator. It's still there, as is the steeper increase
: above that, but actual speeds are all about the paddler's skill and power.

Yes, I'll include resistance pics from kog #6 and #77. It shows clear difference in wave making resistance.

: Side notes on that particular SOF for context (aka - who cares? Feel free to
: skip - just rambling really): It looks Greenlandish but it's not really
: all that much like what most would consider a "Greenland" style
: hull to be. It's a full 6 meters long (19'8" with 18' LWL), has
: rather full ends, moderate overhangs, unpinched gunwales, it's swedeform
: (at deck and waterplane), and overall hull cross-section at widest point
: is more round than boxy.

There's some many different types of Greenland kayaks that it's quite easy to say that this kayak has influences from there. Mix some models and the end result would be like your kayak. Typically the some older (faster and narrower) models didn't have pinch and had less overhangs. Like De Rijp here:

http://www.traditionalkayaks.com/Kayakreplicas/DeRIJP.html

Messages In This Thread

S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/2/2007, 3:02 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip *LINK* *Pic*
Bryan Hansel -- 12/6/2007, 11:12 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/7/2007, 11:53 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Bryan Hansel -- 12/7/2007, 9:00 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Toni V -- 12/7/2007, 1:21 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Acors -- 12/3/2007, 10:48 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/6/2007, 8:55 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Acors -- 12/7/2007, 9:55 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/7/2007, 12:13 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Acors -- 12/7/2007, 8:39 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/9/2007, 2:28 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
AaronH -- 12/7/2007, 10:23 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Acors -- 12/7/2007, 8:31 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
AaronH -- 12/5/2007, 3:18 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Acors -- 12/6/2007, 11:48 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
AaronH -- 12/6/2007, 2:55 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Acors -- 12/7/2007, 9:29 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/3/2007, 4:07 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Acors -- 12/4/2007, 2:27 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/7/2007, 12:08 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Bryan Hansel -- 12/2/2007, 4:27 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/2/2007, 6:20 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/2/2007, 10:06 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Toni V -- 12/3/2007, 2:24 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/3/2007, 10:03 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip *LINK* *Pic*
Kris Buttermore -- 12/4/2007, 5:27 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/4/2007, 6:25 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip *Pic*
Kris Buttermore -- 12/5/2007, 12:12 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/6/2007, 3:14 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Bryan Hansel -- 12/6/2007, 9:56 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Kris Buttermore -- 12/6/2007, 11:21 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Robert McMurray -- 12/5/2007, 3:14 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip *Pic*
Kris Buttermore -- 12/5/2007, 4:59 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/6/2007, 3:20 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Kris Buttermore -- 12/6/2007, 10:02 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Bryan Hansel -- 12/5/2007, 1:17 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip *LINK*
Toni V -- 12/5/2007, 1:48 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip *Pic*
Kris Buttermore -- 12/5/2007, 5:21 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip *LINK* *Pic*
Toni V -- 12/6/2007, 4:07 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip *Pic*
Bryan Hansel -- 12/6/2007, 10:24 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Toni V -- 12/7/2007, 5:35 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Bryan Hansel -- 12/7/2007, 9:10 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Kris Buttermore -- 12/6/2007, 9:49 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip *Pic*
Bryan Hansel -- 12/5/2007, 2:17 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
TOM RAYMOND -- 12/5/2007, 2:31 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Bryan Hansel -- 12/3/2007, 10:22 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Toni V -- 12/3/2007, 11:18 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/3/2007, 3:55 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/3/2007, 3:43 am
Re: FreeShip... a fast kayak? *LINK*
Toni V -- 12/3/2007, 7:05 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Bryan Hansel -- 12/2/2007, 10:31 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/2/2007, 10:41 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Toni V -- 12/2/2007, 5:47 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/2/2007, 2:23 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
Toni V -- 12/2/2007, 3:36 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
mike allen -- 12/2/2007, 5:04 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/2/2007, 3:16 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
mike allen -- 12/2/2007, 4:09 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/2/2007, 2:16 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
mike allen -- 12/2/2007, 3:52 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
mike allen -- 12/2/2007, 5:12 am
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
HenkA -- 12/2/2007, 2:07 pm
Re: S&G: Importing models into FreeShip
mike allen -- 12/2/2007, 4:03 pm