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Sea Kayaks Techniques Bulletin Board

Re: question

Posted By: David
Date: Wednesday, 25 October 2000, at 11:47 a.m.

In Response To: Re: question (Lee)

: David, your "dogma" is reasonable in the context of paddlers with
: minimal rescue skills being led in cold water.
: Kind of brings up the whole topic of responsibility again. If a group is
: being led then the leader should ensure that his/her management/rescue
: skills won't be exceeded for the groups safety. That's where a cohesive
: group is necessary.
: . In the situation where peers are paddling the responsibility for each
: person to honestly communicate their skill level and have a good sense of
: the others skills as well as an understood paddle plan is important and
: will be reflected in a cohesive group, whether that's 3 or 30 boat
: lengths. I must admit that 3-5 boat lengths is easier to understand by
: some people than 50ft- 100yds.

Hi Lee

I agree. But I doubt that 30 boat lengths (or some such distance) really provides any kind of cohesion. If I am knocked unconscious by cold shock, you are of little help to me at that distance. Let's assume the conditions are warm and low risk, what if one member hits a rock shoal, loses their paddle, or wants to tell the group a yacht is headed up behind the group? So the critical distance is very important during travel. It also gets us past this North American "rugged individualism", and into a team. I guess it boils down to being able to pick a good team.

My comments were related to the tour operator, who is taking groups of kayakers out of varying ability. Here, the notion of "float plan", "staying together" and "meeting on that Island" mean different things for different people. The dogma I use insures that no matter what happens, or what I forget to say on shore to prepare the group for travel, we are always together. And yes, it is painful, especially when one person is just dragging and dragging. In cases like those, where one person is compromising the group safety (going pitifully slow during windy crossings), it is wise to break into 2 or more pods, each with its own leader, sweep and members. Could be a group of 2, one strong paddler hanging back with the new, weaker paddler, with the whole group hanging back periodically to allow catch-up. The problem with catch-up is that the slower paddler never gets a break. They paddle along in slow motion until they reach the waiting big group, who now are tired of waiting and anxious to start again. So in cases like this, like you say, you use situational logic. I am shocked by the number of misunderstandings about "where we are going to meet" that occur back-country. "That Island" on the map, may look very different paddling, and result in the group permanently splitting. So I like to keep everyone together, with a back-up plan for the slow paddler, including plenty of bungies and tow line for hauling them along in a husky tow.

You can all arrange to meet ahead, but then why are you paddling together? I think that if you pick your paddling partners well, you can all stay together as a group. Unfortunately, tour operators don't have the luxury, and should obsess with safety, or obsess with insurance troubles later.

Thanks Lee. Things are always situational.

Messages In This Thread

DISTANCE TO PADDLE
BERT -- Monday, 23 October 2000, at 1:29 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
Ray -- Monday, 23 October 2000, at 4:52 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
The Big Legume -- Monday, 23 October 2000, at 8:29 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
M. Hamilton -- Monday, 23 October 2000, at 11:22 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
David -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 10:29 a.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
Ross Leidy -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 11:16 a.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
Bill Bradshaw -- Thursday, 26 October 2000, at 4:04 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
M. Hamilton -- Thursday, 26 October 2000, at 6:31 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
Bill Bradshaw -- Thursday, 26 October 2000, at 11:31 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
Ian Johnston -- Saturday, 28 October 2000, at 7:15 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
M. Hamilton -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 12:07 p.m.
knots per hour
Ed K. -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 1:16 p.m.
Re: knots per hour
Jed -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 2:00 p.m.
Re: knots per hour
Ross Leidy -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 3:03 p.m.
Re: knots per hour
M. Hamilton -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 3:54 p.m.
Tested my speed today
Ted -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 4:48 p.m.
Re: Tested my speed today
Shawn Baker -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 5:04 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
Shawn Baker -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 1:14 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
Tim Smith -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 2:49 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
David -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 4:59 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
Lee -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 7:03 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
Tim Smith -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 10:38 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
Tim Smith -- Wednesday, 25 October 2000, at 12:29 a.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
David -- Wednesday, 25 October 2000, at 1:49 a.m.
Re: question
Lee -- Wednesday, 25 October 2000, at 1:49 a.m.
Re: question
David -- Wednesday, 25 October 2000, at 11:47 a.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
Shawn Baker -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 5:11 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
dave mcadoo -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 5:46 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
BERT -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 6:07 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
Tom Joyce -- Tuesday, 24 October 2000, at 9:34 p.m.
Re: DISTANCE TO PADDLE
Tom Dowling -- Wednesday, 25 October 2000, at 12:47 a.m.

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