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Sea Kayaks Techniques Bulletin Board

Re: I read the rules... and learned something

Posted By: haresfur
Date: Wednesday, 4 August 2004, at 12:18 a.m.

In Response To: Re: I read the rules... and learned something (Shawn Baker)

Sorry, but I still don't read the rule this way. The rule says light or lantern and you must show it early enough to avoid a collision, not only just barely in time to avoid a collision. So how are you to realistically judge that time? The fact that a small power boat underway *may* exhibit a minimum of a 360 degree visible light tells me that when you see a visible single white light it does *not* mean a vessel at anchor but can also mean a slowly moving vessel:

"a power-driven vessel of less than 7 meters in length whose maximum speed does not exceed 7 knots may in lieu of the lights prescribed in paragraph (a) of this Rule exhibit an all-round white light and shall, if practicable, also exhibit sidelights."

Yes that specific section of rule 23 relates to minimum requirements for power vessels but does not seem to preclude the continuous use of a light for a vessel under oars under rule 25.

Quite frankly it strains common sense to require kayaks to travel in stealth mode until it appears that someone is about to collide with you. Ok, we're talking government here, but really? "Sufficient time to prevent collision" doesn't IMHO preclude showing the light sooner - only that if you don't show any light until it is too late, it is your own d*mn fault. Don't forget a small power vessel traveling at speeds within the range of paddle speed will be showing a white light at a minimum. Why would it not be ok for a kayak? Why would it be more safe for a kayak to travel with no visible light? And I still think a lantern, which is allowed, can be a 360 degree visible light.

Respectfully,

-- Evan (who really is trying to understand this)

: Yes...but exhibited only before, and to avoid collision. Not a prophylactic
: light.

: Shawn

Messages In This Thread

Optimum running lights sought
Dan -- Wednesday, 13 December 2000, at 10:08 p.m.
Meaning of *NM*
Nick Schade -- Thursday, 14 December 2000, at 9:55 a.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
Todd Bradshaw -- Thursday, 14 December 2000, at 12:32 p.m.
Re: Red Strobes
Shawn Baker -- Thursday, 14 December 2000, at 1:25 p.m.
Strobes are considered distress signals...
Jabberwocky -- Friday, 12 November 2004, at 4:43 p.m.
2000 was a good year
shawn baker -- Tuesday, 16 November 2004, at 4:18 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
risto -- Thursday, 14 December 2000, at 1:31 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
Capt. M. Hamilton -- Thursday, 14 December 2000, at 6:19 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
Dan -- Thursday, 14 December 2000, at 7:56 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
Lee -- Thursday, 14 December 2000, at 11:12 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
M.Hamilton -- Friday, 15 December 2000, at 1:32 a.m.
Funny, I thought the exact same thing
Jerry -- Friday, 15 December 2000, at 11:58 a.m.
Re: Funny, I thought the exact same thing
Will -- Wednesday, 10 November 2004, at 11:11 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
Don Beale -- Friday, 15 December 2000, at 12:34 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
M.Hamilton -- Friday, 15 December 2000, at 9:11 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
Don Beale -- Saturday, 16 December 2000, at 1:37 a.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
M. Hamilton -- Saturday, 16 December 2000, at 4:00 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
MH again -- Saturday, 16 December 2000, at 4:06 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
Don Beale -- Sunday, 17 December 2000, at 1:03 a.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
MH -- Sunday, 17 December 2000, at 10:57 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
Don Beale -- Monday, 18 December 2000, at 2:22 p.m.
Red flasher not in rules = OK to use?
mike allen ---> -- Friday, 15 December 2000, at 7:52 p.m.
Re: Red flasher not in rules = OK to use?
M.Hamilton -- Friday, 15 December 2000, at 9:04 p.m.
Re: Red flasher not in rules = OK to use?
M.Hamilton -- Friday, 15 December 2000, at 9:31 p.m.
Red flasher only on rudolph
mike allen ---> -- Monday, 18 December 2000, at 1:55 p.m.
Re: Red flasher not in rules = OK to use?
Earl Bailey -- Saturday, 16 December 2000, at 2:52 p.m.
Re: Red flasher not in rules = OK to use?
FBC -- Thursday, 21 December 2000, at 7:19 p.m.
lights used
tom -- Saturday, 16 December 2000, at 1:09 a.m.
Re: lights used
M.Hamilton -- Saturday, 16 December 2000, at 11:41 a.m.
High Speed Drunks *Pic*
Robert Woodard -- Friday, 15 December 2000, at 5:00 p.m.
Re: High Speed Drunks
Ian Johnston -- Friday, 15 December 2000, at 9:48 p.m.
Re: Thanks for locating the photo *NM*
Shawn Baker -- Friday, 15 December 2000, at 9:48 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
Todd Bradshaw -- Thursday, 14 December 2000, at 11:48 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
M.Hamilton -- Friday, 15 December 2000, at 12:49 a.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
Todd Bradshaw -- Friday, 15 December 2000, at 2:09 a.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
Terry -- Friday, 15 December 2000, at 7:25 p.m.
running lights thread
risto -- Saturday, 16 December 2000, at 8:22 a.m.
Re: running lights thread
M.Hamilton -- Saturday, 16 December 2000, at 12:28 p.m.
Re: running lights thread
risto -- Monday, 18 December 2000, at 3:28 a.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
David -- Saturday, 16 December 2000, at 9:06 a.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
Will -- Wednesday, 10 November 2004, at 11:01 p.m.
Thank you, all!
Les Groby -- Saturday, 16 December 2000, at 12:15 p.m.
hearing
tom -- Saturday, 16 December 2000, at 7:36 p.m.
Re: hearing
Don Beale -- Sunday, 17 December 2000, at 1:11 a.m.
Re: hearing
MH -- Sunday, 17 December 2000, at 11:00 p.m.
No Strobes; link to red-green bow lights *LINK*
Mark -- Thursday, 29 July 2004, at 9:41 a.m.
Re: No Strobes; link to red-green bow lights
Tim Mattson -- Thursday, 29 July 2004, at 1:46 p.m.
Re: All round white light
Roy Morford -- Thursday, 29 July 2004, at 3:15 p.m.
What is so hard!!!
Capt. M. hamilton -- Thursday, 29 July 2004, at 8:09 p.m.
Re: What is so hard!!!
LeeG -- Thursday, 29 July 2004, at 9:45 p.m.
Re: What is so hard!!!
Brian Nystrom -- Thursday, 29 July 2004, at 10:16 p.m.
Re: What is so hard!!!
LeeG -- Friday, 30 July 2004, at 3:15 p.m.
Different regs *LINK*
Kris Buttermore -- Friday, 30 July 2004, at 4:47 p.m.
Re: What is so hard!!!
Brian Nystrom -- Friday, 30 July 2004, at 4:58 p.m.
Coastal vs. Inland
Shawn Baker -- Monday, 2 August 2004, at 7:09 p.m.
Re: Coastal vs. Inland
Brian Nystrom -- Monday, 2 August 2004, at 7:28 p.m.
Re: I'll accept your apology later
Roy Morford -- Thursday, 29 July 2004, at 11:06 p.m.
What is so hard!--Look here...
Mark -- Friday, 30 July 2004, at 9:17 a.m.
Ya'll still don't get it
M. Hamilton -- Friday, 30 July 2004, at 1:34 p.m.
One problem
Karl -- Friday, 30 July 2004, at 3:29 p.m.
Problem two
Karl -- Friday, 30 July 2004, at 3:40 p.m.
Re: Problem two
Shawn Baker -- Monday, 2 August 2004, at 7:11 p.m.
360 white means at anchor only? WRONG!!!
Kris Buttermore -- Friday, 30 July 2004, at 4:49 p.m.
Canada US differences too! Be careful with advice.
Kris Buttermore -- Friday, 30 July 2004, at 4:52 p.m.
Last word from me on this
M. Hamilton -- Friday, 30 July 2004, at 6:03 p.m.
Re: Last word from me on this
Brian Nystrom -- Sunday, 1 August 2004, at 9:38 a.m.
Re: Last word from me on this
Robert Woodard -- Sunday, 1 August 2004, at 10:23 a.m.
Re: Last word from me on this
mark -- Thursday, 5 August 2004, at 12:40 p.m.
Re: Last word from me on this
Shawn Baker -- Thursday, 5 August 2004, at 2:05 p.m.
Re: My Last Word
Roy Morford -- Thursday, 5 August 2004, at 4:24 p.m.
information dissemination
Karl -- Friday, 6 August 2004, at 2:55 p.m.
Re: information dissemination
Shawn Baker -- Wednesday, 11 August 2004, at 6:37 p.m.
Re: information dissemination
Karl -- Thursday, 12 August 2004, at 12:07 a.m.
Re: 360 white means at anchor only? WRONG!!!
Karl -- Friday, 30 July 2004, at 9:46 p.m.
Re: Display in time
Roy Morford -- Saturday, 31 July 2004, at 1:28 a.m.
Re: Display in time
LeeG -- Saturday, 31 July 2004, at 8:18 a.m.
Re: Display in time
Karl -- Saturday, 31 July 2004, at 12:19 p.m.
Right of way
Kris Buttermore -- Sunday, 1 August 2004, at 7:29 p.m.
Re: Right of way
Karl -- Tuesday, 3 August 2004, at 12:13 p.m.
Re: Kayakers have right of way.....
Shawn Baker -- Monday, 2 August 2004, at 7:19 p.m.
Re: Kayakers NEVER have right of way.....
Kris Buttermore -- Tuesday, 3 August 2004, at 12:58 p.m.
Re: Kayakers NEVER have right of way.....
Shawn Baker -- Tuesday, 3 August 2004, at 1:55 p.m.
RIGHT OF WAY can be given but not taken
Reg Lake -- Tuesday, 3 August 2004, at 2:02 p.m.
Re: Optimum running lights sought
Robert Woodard -- Friday, 30 July 2004, at 9:10 p.m.
I read the rules... and learned something *LINK*
Mike in Atlanta -- Friday, 30 July 2004, at 9:42 p.m.
Re: I read the rules... and learned something *LINK*
haresfur -- Monday, 2 August 2004, at 11:32 p.m.
Re: I guess that would be a headlight!!! *NM*
Roy Morford -- Tuesday, 3 August 2004, at 1:20 a.m.
Re: I read the rules... and learned something *LINK*
Mike in Atlanta -- Tuesday, 3 August 2004, at 7:59 a.m.
Re: I read the rules... and learned something
LeeG -- Tuesday, 3 August 2004, at 8:37 a.m.
Re: I read the rules... and learned something
Ed Hopkins -- Tuesday, 3 August 2004, at 12:31 p.m.
Re: I read the rules... and learned something
Shawn Baker -- Tuesday, 3 August 2004, at 12:49 p.m.
Re: I read the rules... and learned something
Ed Hopkins -- Tuesday, 3 August 2004, at 5:46 p.m.
Re: I read the rules... and learned something
Shawn Baker -- Wednesday, 11 August 2004, at 6:40 p.m.
Re: I read the rules... and learned something
haresfur -- Wednesday, 4 August 2004, at 12:18 a.m.
Re: I read the rules... and learned something
Karl -- Wednesday, 4 August 2004, at 12:25 p.m.
Re: I read the rules... and learned something
Robert Woodard -- Tuesday, 3 August 2004, at 11:27 p.m.
Re: I read the rules... and learned something
Robert Woodard -- Tuesday, 3 August 2004, at 11:31 p.m.
Re: I read the rules... and learned something *LINK*
Mike in Atlanta -- Wednesday, 4 August 2004, at 7:10 a.m.
Kayak lighting tests *LINK*
Kris Buttermore -- Sunday, 1 August 2004, at 7:39 p.m.
Re: Kayak lighting tests *LINK*
martin lister -- Sunday, 1 August 2004, at 10:36 p.m.
Re: Kayak lighting tests *LINK* *Pic*
Mike Massey -- Tuesday, 9 November 2004, at 3:05 a.m.
Re: Kayak lighting tests
Tim Mattson -- Tuesday, 9 November 2004, at 3:01 p.m.
Re: Kayak lighting tests - Tim is right
Roy Morford -- Tuesday, 9 November 2004, at 4:18 p.m.
Re: Kayak lighting tests - Tim is right *LINK* *Pic*
Mike Massey -- Wednesday, 10 November 2004, at 4:33 a.m.
Re: Kayak lighting tests - novice question
Evan Shaw -- Wednesday, 10 November 2004, at 8:47 a.m.
good question,,,consumer culture
LeeG -- Wednesday, 10 November 2004, at 11:47 a.m.
Re: Kayak lighting tests *LINK*
Kelly -- Tuesday, 9 November 2004, at 3:03 p.m.
Re: Kayak lighting tests *LINK*
Kris Buttermore -- Wednesday, 10 November 2004, at 10:03 a.m.
Re: Kayak lighting tests
Mike Massey -- Wednesday, 10 November 2004, at 4:15 p.m.
TekTite lights *LINK*
Will -- Thursday, 11 November 2004, at 1:33 a.m.
Re: TekTite lights - call them to order
Kris Buttermore -- Friday, 12 November 2004, at 10:30 a.m.
Re: Kayak lighting tests
Don Lucas -- Wednesday, 17 November 2004, at 12:13 p.m.
Re: Kayak lighting tests
Kris Buttermore -- Thursday, 18 November 2004, at 10:50 a.m.

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