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Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
By:Rob Macks/Laughing Loon CC&K
Date: 3/27/2014, 1:29 am
In Response To: Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru (aikijay)

Can you clarify why it would be counter productive to plane? Nick goes on quite a bit about how you must fair the curves and make shavings. Whether you mainly sand or mainly plane the surface has to be smoothed.

We build with wood strips because they create fair curves naturally. If we ensure the strips are, and remain, in contact with the stations, and strip edges are aligned between stations, we have a fair hull. So the number one priority should be to align strips edges. and ensure strips remain in contact with the stations.

In traditional strip building 1/4" thick strips are forced into place. Strips near the keel and at the stems are the most challenging to force into place. Force results in strip edges being misaligned if the strip won't yield. If bead and cove strips are used and can't be aligned, serious gaps are created.

For many years I've urged builders to use 3/16" thick strips, which are much easier to bend, twist and place. Along with the use of a heat gun, strips can be placed without force and a fair surface can easily be achieved. Before any surfacing takes place, strips should be aligned and fair, whatever it takes. If they are not, aggressive surfacing will be counterproductive, moving away from a fair surface.

In the 70's and 80's, before modern random orbital sanders came along, strip builders used 7" & 9" grinders with sanding disks to surface strippers. This very aggressive tool was difficult to handle and cut with only an edge of the disk. Most often it produced a surface of ripples. I know, I've done it. With no dust extraction, you had to suit up for deep sea diving to engage in this onerous task.

No wonder some people started using a plane to level an irregular area rather than sand. A strip builder (before Nick) decided he would prefer to go over the hull with a plane, rather than use the dust choking, disk grinder. He wrote about how wonderful it was to plane a stripper canoe surface, and no one questioned whether it was a good idea or not. A lot of people have followed this idea without question.

A plane has a fixed depth of cut with each stroke. That fixed cut destroys a fair surface. Overlapping strokes dig deeper and deeper. Try planing a dinner table. What happens? A strip has a fair surface just as a table top, or plywood panel, in stitch-n-glue boat, just on a different scale. Would you hit a plywood panel with a plane? Would you use a plane to fair your fiberglass surface? Try it. Once is all you'll need.

A Random Orbital Sander is a unique tool, ideal for smoothing the curved surfaces of a stripper while maintaining a fair surface. The ROS is used by holding the whole disk surface flat against the wood following the curved surface, in any direction. The sandpaper automatically concentrates more aggressive cutting on high spots while reducing its aggressiveness on a fair surface.

How does it do this? It's like the old "bed of nails" trick. With a vast number of points of grit, the cutting aggressiveness is spread over a large area and does very little. Just like a person can lay on the bed of nails and not get stuck. Basic physics. But if there is a high point which lifts the surrounding disk off the larger surface, the high point will be aggressively knocked down.

Most people would never think of starting to sand using anything heavier than 80 grit sandpaper. Furniture builders use 80 grit to remove scratches left by thickness planers. And this is why we don't like sanding, because it doesn't seem to get the job done quickly.

To do a quick job I recommend using 60 grit with the ROS, held flat, rotated lightly following the hull curves. Holding the ROS very lightly and letting the disk spin fast cuts more aggressively than with heavy pressure. And change paper often. Even on soft wood, the sharpness of new paper does not last long. This will create a uniform matt sanded surface which will not destroy the natural fair surface.

A plane can only damage a fair surface.

Things which seemed like a good idea a few years ago, can change.

All the best,
Rob

Messages In This Thread

Strip: Order of Operations
aikijay -- 3/26/2014, 2:15 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
Lomic -- 3/26/2014, 2:23 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
John Messinger -- 3/26/2014, 3:02 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
Jay Stallman -- 3/26/2014, 3:51 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
John Messinger -- 3/26/2014, 3:59 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
aikijay -- 3/26/2014, 5:16 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
John Messinger -- 3/26/2014, 5:48 pm
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
Rob Macks/Laughing Loon CC&K -- 3/26/2014, 5:30 pm
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
aikijay -- 3/26/2014, 9:56 pm
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
Rob Macks/Laughing Loon CC&K -- 3/27/2014, 1:29 am
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
Lomic -- 3/27/2014, 3:20 am
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
aikijay -- 3/27/2014, 7:21 am
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
Rob Macks/Laughing Loon CC&K -- 3/27/2014, 8:29 am
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
Jay Babina -- 3/27/2014, 8:48 am
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
Dan Caouette (CSCWC) -- 3/27/2014, 9:17 am
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
Bill Hamm -- 3/28/2014, 8:33 am
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
Rob Macks/Laughing Loon CC&K -- 3/28/2014, 11:14 am
Old sayings...
Dan Caouette (CSCWC) -- 3/27/2014, 9:21 am
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
Rob Macks/Laughing Loon CC&K -- 4/1/2014, 6:20 pm
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
aikijay -- 4/1/2014, 9:33 pm
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
MattD. -- 3/27/2014, 9:53 am
Re: Strip: The Hot Glue Guru
Etienne Muller -- 3/27/2014, 3:03 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
Rod Tait -- 3/27/2014, 10:56 am
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
Jay Stallman -- 3/27/2014, 12:47 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
Rod Tait -- 3/27/2014, 12:57 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
Jay Stallman -- 3/27/2014, 1:54 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
Rob Macks/Laughing Loon CC&K -- 3/27/2014, 2:18 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
Phil -- 4/5/2014, 10:40 am
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
Rob Macks/Laughing Loon CC&K -- 4/5/2014, 2:31 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
Phil -- 4/5/2014, 3:16 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
Rob Macks/Laughing Loon CC&K -- 4/5/2014, 4:13 pm
Re: Strip: Order of Operations
Bill Hamm -- 4/6/2014, 1:05 am
Re: Strip: Order of Operations *PIC*
Rob Macks/Laughing Loon CC&K -- 4/6/2014, 8:53 am
How about a different order of operations? *PIC*
Dan Caouette (CSCWC) -- 3/27/2014, 2:07 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Jay Stallman -- 3/27/2014, 2:59 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Dan Caouette (CSCWC) -- 3/27/2014, 3:16 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Jay Stallman -- 3/27/2014, 10:58 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Rod Tait -- 3/28/2014, 10:15 am
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Jay Stallman -- 3/30/2014, 8:49 am
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Rod Tait -- 3/30/2014, 12:23 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
george jung -- 3/30/2014, 1:17 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
JohnAbercrombie -- 3/30/2014, 1:47 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Rod Tait -- 3/30/2014, 2:14 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Jay Stallman -- 3/30/2014, 2:47 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
JohnAbercrombie -- 3/30/2014, 3:00 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Bill Hamm -- 3/31/2014, 12:35 am
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Bill Hamm -- 3/31/2014, 12:34 am
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Jay Stallman -- 3/30/2014, 4:08 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
JohnAbercrombie -- 3/30/2014, 7:31 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
ancient kayaker -- 3/30/2014, 8:59 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
aikijay -- 3/30/2014, 10:59 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
JohnAbercrombie -- 3/30/2014, 11:30 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Jay Stallman -- 3/30/2014, 11:57 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
ancient kayaker -- 3/31/2014, 12:49 am
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Bill Hamm -- 3/31/2014, 1:07 am
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Jay Stallman -- 3/31/2014, 8:09 am
Re: How about a different order of operations? *PIC*
JohnAbercrombie -- 3/31/2014, 12:56 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Bill Hamm -- 4/1/2014, 12:55 am
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Jay Stallman -- 3/31/2014, 9:05 am
Re: How about a different order of operations? *PIC*
Dan Caouette (CSCWC) -- 3/31/2014, 10:11 am
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Jay Stallman -- 3/31/2014, 12:40 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
JohnAbercrombie -- 3/31/2014, 1:12 pm
End Pours
Dan Caouette (CSCWC) -- 3/31/2014, 1:22 pm
Re: End Pours
Jay Stallman -- 3/31/2014, 2:20 pm
Re: End Pours
JohnAbercrombie -- 3/31/2014, 2:32 pm
Re: End Pours
Dan Caouette (CSCWC) -- 3/31/2014, 2:35 pm
Re: End Pours
Jay Stallman -- 3/31/2014, 4:23 pm
Re: End Pours
Bill Hamm -- 4/1/2014, 1:05 am
Re: End Pours
Dan -- 4/1/2014, 10:19 am
Re: End Pours
Jay Stallman -- 4/1/2014, 10:43 am
Microballoons
John Messinger -- 4/1/2014, 11:48 am
Re: Microballoons
Jay Stallman -- 4/1/2014, 1:51 pm
Re: Microballoons
Dan -- 4/1/2014, 4:20 pm
Re: End Pours *PIC*
Nick Schade - Guillemot Kayaks -- 3/31/2014, 5:55 pm
Re: End Pours *PIC*
Shawn Jones -- 4/1/2014, 2:24 am
Re: End Pours
Bill Hamm -- 4/1/2014, 1:01 am
Re: End Pours
Dan Caouette (CSCWC) -- 4/1/2014, 8:46 am
Re: How about a different order of operations?
aikijay -- 3/30/2014, 11:21 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Rod Tait -- 3/31/2014, 10:44 am
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Jay Stallman -- 3/31/2014, 12:47 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Rod Tait -- 3/31/2014, 4:43 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
george jung -- 4/1/2014, 7:50 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Bill Hamm -- 3/28/2014, 8:41 am
Re: How about a different order of operations?
george jung -- 3/28/2014, 11:12 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations? *PIC*
Dan Caouette (CSCWC) -- 3/29/2014, 6:16 am
Re: How about a different order of operations?
george jung -- 3/29/2014, 10:17 am
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Rod Tait -- 3/29/2014, 11:17 am
Re: How about a different order of operations? *PIC*
Dan Caouette (CSCWC) -- 3/29/2014, 3:43 pm
Re: How about a different order of operations?
Rod Tait -- 3/27/2014, 3:20 pm